Problem with Array Split and Build. I might cry.

[Spogg]

I’m going crazy with this issue! Spent hours on it yesterday.

The behaviour in my schematic is even more problematic than the demo schematic attached but the demo illustrates the nature of my problem.

I’ve tried various different triggering solutions but nothing has worked so far.

My goal was to split a float array and use the simple preset modules for DAW modulation of my graphic eq, then re-build the array for the graph display and the rest of the schematic. It seems to me that the Build Array prim isn’t playing nicely, but my logic has failed me on this occasion.

I do hope one of you lovely guys can assist, even if it’s only to confirm a bug. A fix and an explanation would be a real bonus.

In the meantime if I do fix it I’ll post my solution.

Cheers

Spogg

[tulamide]

I don't think it's a bug. When I open this schematic with the stable v3.0.6 I have it working well. BUT: The knob behaves strangely. For example, sometimes after having turned the knob, before releasing the mouse button, the array value 3 on the far right is one step behind, but updates as soon as you release the mouse.

Give it a try with a more recent, and easier knob (easier in terms of amount of code/green, recent just to eliminate any compatibility issues from knobs done for Synthmaker).

[Spogg]

Thanks tulamide, for taking the time to look at this for me.

The key thing in your post is that it works fine in 3.06 and that inclines me to think it’s a bug in 3.08.

If you agree that it must be a bug I’ll tell Maik and Malc. But not before I’ve tried it in 3.09 latest alpha (I’ll make it from scratch so no corruption is carried over) and I’ll report back.

I noticed the rather strange mouse-up-to-update-the-float thing. This doesn’t happen in the upper part.

On your suggestion I did try various variations of knobs, including a Ruby-based one, but I got the same result. Interestingly, the very simplest of old SM knobs I have wouldn’t display the correct input value at all on the float readout (in the lower section).

In my actual real schematic I’m using the Float array from the graphic eq as source, not knobs at all. That just behaves crazy so I made the more simple demo to show that there is a problem, even if it’s with me.


Cheers

Spogg

[tulamide]

I would love to see more tests from other forum members then. If they can confirm that it works in 3.0.6 but not in 3.0.8.1, then I would also call it a bug introduced somewhere between those two versions.

I'm just careful, because the past has shown us several times, that schematics sometimes have illogical "hiccups" that are gone when rebuilding the same structure in a new schematic, and sometimes even when run on another machine. Now I don't want you to do this, because it is too much work. It would be easier, as said, if more people would report their results here.

[Spogg]

Yeah I’ve had that issue with duff schematics and it’s often a selector prim that needs to be replaced. It also helps sometimes to close FS, open a browser to remove FS from memory (or reboot the PC) and a weird issue will sometimes disappear. But not in this case (sadly).

In my real schematic I did try to replace all the relevant prims before I made the demo.

However, I’ve now tested in 3.09 (most recent alpha) under Win 7 x64. The imported demo schematic behaved the same so I remade it from scratch and still the same result, even down to the knob release issue (with different knobs again).

Like you say, if some kind soul could also try it in an earlier version of FS it would help Malc/Maik, if it is indeed a bug.

Incidentally, I think I’ve accidentally uncovered a bug in the 3.09 alpha preset manager but I shall check stuff further before reporting it. The manager appears to ignore that I’ve set the knobs not to be preset-enabled and carried on addressing them.

Thanks again,

Spogg

[Walter Sommerfeld]

Hi Spogg,
i only have a workaround:
just add change prims after the Preset value modules...
Works in Skylark v3.0.8.1

Cheers & Happy new YEAR!!!

P.S.: 2 reduce triggers on the Splitter outputs:
also add change prims here...
so 1 instead of 4 on every output on preset change

I think I’ve accidentally uncovered a bug in the 3.09 alpha preset manager

...Maik knows about this because i reported this earlier

[tulamide]

I also discovered something while testing in 3.0.9 alpha. No solution, but try this for yourself:

I got rid of the preset manager for testing purposes. Error still present, so it is not the manager module. The four preset value modules however behave strange. I added a fifth value (for the whole row, but only the lower one, since the upper without the preset value modules work). If I now change values, then ctrl-click on first, then second, then third, then fourth and finally fifth knob, the array changes are
1 - successful the first time
2 - no change first time, changes successfully the second time (which is: when you ctrl-click the third button)
3 - same as for 2
4 - same as for 2
5 - can't be updated a second time, since it is the last one.

It seems the issue propagates starting from triggering the first preset value module. This definitely is an issue - you have to rely on preset handling not delaying or demanding a second trigger.

[Spogg]

To Walter and tulamide: Many thanks!

Walter:

Your work-around works and I have no understanding as to why it should! I thought those little Change prims prevented “backwards” triggers, so they only allow trigger when a signal level has actually changed. But this signal does change and I’m not over concerned about trigger storms at the moment.

I have an idea that the Change prim must send a trigger after a change has been made, so maybe it’s a green timing issue. I count no more triggers after the Change prim so maybe it is timing.

Tulamide:

I do think there’s something screwy with this preset thing. I would love to know if it started with 3.08 though.

------------------------------------------------------

My real schematic is mostly working now BUT it won’t recall the array from a preset change. If I load the preset from the txt file, the graph and everything works. So I do a Save preset and save the schematic, but when I recall the preset the array doesn’t update unless I click on the Preset array prim’s output. Then it appears. I shall work on this further of course and see how it goes.
Do you think I should report this? I’d like to wait until someone else can try it in 3.06…

Cheers

Spogg

[Spogg]

My real schematic is mostly working now BUT it won’t recall the array from a preset change. If I load the preset from the txt file, the graph and everything works. So I do a Save preset and save the schematic, but when I recall the preset the array doesn’t update unless I click on the Preset array prim’s output. Then it appears. I shall work on this further of course and see how it goes.

Well this was an easy fix
I just added an After Preset Change trigger to the array in question and it works! But why???
If I don't understand something I can't learn it. It becomes just a formula, like a magickal incantation. I never had to do that before either.

Cheers

Spogg

[Spogg]

Guys!

I think I’ve proved it’s a trigger timing issue.

See the fix I came up with which provides a later trigger, 1mS after any change in the input array.
This shouldn’t be necessary though.
Or should it?

I should add that Walter's work-around works more smoothly than mine in the real schematic (too many triggers in mine I think, so the graph jitters when you change it).

Cheers

Spogg